Early training for a small child

[Bombard]

I'm looking for a pellet rifle for early training for my daughter, who's just turning 4. She's 40" tall and 35 lbs.

I already have a 22 single shot that's sized for a small child (a Henry Mini-Bolt) but she's a little too young for it yet. I want to do some back-yard, 10 meter balloons and tin cans with her for a year or so before we get out to the range.

The problem is, all the pellet guns I've found are adult size. Any suggestions?

[joe]

I dont know, I think 4 is a little too young for any type of firearm...IMO

I think there's a reason why manufacturers dont make child size guns.

[Harry Carry]

Just be careful. Most urban cities prohibit the discharge of air rifles, even on your own property. Check their muni code. You don't want the police showing up because a neighbor called in.

[Quietpi]

IMO also, four is much too young. While I reserve the right to do a lot more thinking on the subject, I don't think I would be too keen on a child under, oh, eight, handling a firearm under any circumstances. Motor coordination, hand-eye coordination, ability to understand the importance of safety, maturity enough even to understand what's going on, just aren't there.

This from a father of an adult violinist who started playing at age two. Many of the same considerations and limitations exist, and limit what a child can and should try to play. And a violin is a heck of a lot safer than a firearm.

[SierraNevadaCCW]

I started my son shooting at age 4. He enjoys our outtings in the 4x4 up to a range spot and I help him shoot my pistols. Four is not too young...if you are helping her, holding it with her, etc.

My daughter is now 4. I will start her next year at 5. It depends on the kid...everyone is different. My son is now 6 and loves going to the range....just like his old man.

[1buba]

The chipmunk is actually a .22 built just for kids.

I don't think that 4 is too young. The childs age isn't nearly as important and the parents brain (or lack there of).



Bombast,
First, Harry Carry has a great point.

As I haven't seen a pellet gun of the necessary size, you might think about a chipmunk (or one of the other brand versions) and CB caps in .22. They are basically a .22 caliber ball and just the primer to power it.

[akulahawk]

It really does depend upon the kid. Some may be ready that early, some not until much later. My own 4 year old daughter isn't quite ready yet.

Oh, and I was also looking at the Chipmunk rifle too. The stock of the one I was looking at is in my daughter's favorite color. Pink.

[Harry Carry]

From Santa Ana municipal code:

Sec. 10-149. Weapons; discharge of firearms.
(a) No person, except in self defense, shall discharge, or cause or allow the discharge of any rifle, shotgun, pistol, revolver, or any other firearm, or any airgun, gas gun, or any other weapon which emits a projectile as a result of pressure at the breech, unless said person has first obtained permission in writing from the chief of police, and then only in compliance with all the conditions contained in said permission. This section does not apply to any peace officer in the discharge of his duty.

[Bombard]

I have a Chipmunk that I bought at the OC fairgrounds for $20 - but compared to the Henry, it's crap, if it weren't a gun I'd throw it away. The Henry is the same size, real sights, made of stainless, with a crisp 3 lb trigger and a custom serial number - her initials and 001. And I painted the stock camoflage - pink and purple. Of course, it's still a 22, and most of the ranges won't let her shoot. She has the coordination - she can walk tightrope if she has an umbrella in one hand (no exageration, for her third birthday she asked me to make her a tightrope in the back yard, it's 6" off the ground.)

I didn't know the mc included airguns. Ah, well, they've run every gun shop out of the city, so I should have expected it. Of course, from the number of spent bullets I find on my roof, it's not enforced very well against 38 super.

[Spicy McHaggis]

Okay I have to do it:

How about an Official Red Ryder Carbine-Action Two-Hundred-Shot Range Model Air Rifle with a compass in the stock and that thing that tells time!

Most companies nowadays won't market toy guns to kids that actually shoot pellets or BBs directly. The anti-gun groups and everyone else would be all over them if they did. You might be able to find some small lightweight airsoft guns that would fit her hands. I don't know much about airsoft, so couldn't recommend any models.

Four is a good age to teach them about guns and gun safety. Only you and her mother can know for sure if she is mature enough to handle it at that age. Good luck in your search.

[spc]

I started my son with a pump Benjamin pellet pistol when he was about 5-6. I would poump it and he would sight and shoot. While I was pumping and loading it we would talk about safety and aiming. I would let him drop the pellet into the chamber and interact as much as possible. I also showed him how everything works so as he becamd strong enough he knew how to use and load the pistol.

This seemed to work well as he now shoots regularly and has had excellent safety. My son is almost an adult now in his 2nd year in college.

spc

[Walt Lear]

I think early SAFE training is a very positive thing.

When I was 8 the my public school partnered with the UC Davis psych program to test the effectiveness of the "eddie eagle" NRA program. With parents permission half the students were shown the eddie eagle stuff, the other half got violent movies like Die Hard. I was one of the Die Hard group.

Then 2 weeks later they put in an experiment room filled with toys, and a 9mm Beretta laying in clear sight on the table. It was loaded with inert rounds but I didn't know that until later.

My dad had a Beretta 92, I'd shot it and cleaned it, it wasn't a big deal. I was worried about the other kids. So I walked to it, dropped the magazine and tried to cycle the slide. I wasn't strong enough, so I pushed the takedown button on the right, rotated the lever and stripped the slide off the frame. About then the other kids were gathered around me and telling me to stop. I used a pencil to lever out the recoil spring, extracted the barrel, and pulled the last round from the chamber with my fingernails. Then I put the barrel in my pocket, put everything else back on the table, and went to give it to the "teacher." Looking back I'm surprised at how calm the adults were. I should have known right away that something was wrong, she didn't react when I gave her the barrell, she just said "well, we'll have to go take care of this, won't we?"

I don't know if they included it in their final report or not, we never got to see that.

[DVSmith]

Age is a very dubious method of determining the physical, mental and emotional ability of a human being to participate in any activity. I started teaching one of my sons to ride a motorcycle at age 4 the other one at age 6. What were the differences? One had much better balance and fine motor skills at a younger age. Both were incompetent to maneuver a motorcycle in traffic, but were capable of managing and maneuvering a motorcycle with very close management from an adult running alongside ready to lift the rear wheel off the ground if they got out of control in a wide open dirt field.

What does this have to do with teaching a four year old to shoot? I consider them to both be activities that undertaken with the proper oversight can be either reasonably safe or without the proper oversight extremely dangerous.

In the end it is you the parent that has to determine their capacity to understand and follow directions. It is also you the parent that takes on the responsibility for any mishap or injury that occurs as a result of your child's activity.

In BSA, we start Cub Scouts out with BB guns as early as in the first grade on supervised ranges where each Cub gets a single round fed into their BB gun at a time. This give the range master and RSO's the ability to react and limits the damage to one round of fire. It is also the standard established by BSA. Frequently the smallest (although not necessarily youngest) shooters require BB Guns that have shortened stocks. We can't solve the trigger finger length problem if they have extremely small hands. BB Gun Stocks can be cut down or sometimes come with removable segments to adjust their length.

The only word or caution beyond the obvious safety concerns is that you can burn a little person out on shooting really easily if they are not having fun and improving as they go. At young ages they can get discourage by a better shooter (like yourself) showing off then feeling incapable of keeping up. Come to think of it, that is probably true of older shooters too!

Oh, and just to reiterate a previous post, BB Guns and Air Soft are prohibited in many municipalities. If you don't already own a copy, be sure to buy "Own a Gun & Stay Out of Jail" by John Machtinger.

[DVSmith]

Originally Posted by DVSmith

Oh, and just to reiterate a previous post, BB Guns and Air Soft are prohibited in many municipalities. If you don't already own a copy, be sure to buy "Own a Gun & Stay Out of Jail" by John Machtinger.

Sorry, that should read "...the discharge of BB guns and Air Soft is prohibited..."

[inboost]

I would like to second the comments DVSmith made about how kids can become discouraged quickly and lose interest. My younger son becomes quite upset when he sees his dad and older brother bust targets time and again while he struggles to hit the backstop. I work very closely with both boys (presently 15 and 9) and have only allowed them to shoot the .22LR stuff in my collection so far. The Winchester 9422 .22LR lever gun is a great rifle as it doesn't allow high speed antics and rewards moderate care with precision shot placement. My younger son just can't enjoy it as it's too heavy to hold, doesn't bench shoot well (lever hits the bench) and length of pull just isn't right for him even though I nearly hold it off my shoulder to shoot it. So instead we work with a Colt Cadet pistol in .22LR which he really loves. He can shoot it on his own both standing and on a rest and with modest range can usually break down the clay pigeons, paper plates, old compact discs, and empty soda cans we bring with us. The refined shooting skills just aren't there yet for him, but he's got the safety aspect down cold. Whenever we go shooting I quiz the boys over and over until we're on our way home again. Both of them know their stuff, and in my belief, will do the right thing when they find themselves in any kind of firearms related situation.

The good news is that kids are really good at picking up brass, broken CDs, clay pigeons, and ratty soda cans. The bad news is they can't be expected to clean a gun (Momma definitely won't have her kids up to their elbows in solvent!).

So I would recommend a moderately sized semi-automatic .22LR pistol over a rifle for the young kids. Remember that even though it's a bit heavy, the extra mass absorbs recoil. Start them at a bench with a sand bag or something similar (that you don't care too much about!) for a rest so they don't have to lift/hold it up (Barrel on the bag, grip frame on the table).The single action trigger pull usually isn't too much and the reciprocation of the action further absorbs recoil. Keep in mind that small hands/fingers usually can't work hammers on revolvers and of course a DA pull is far too heavy to start out on. Look for something with a narrow grip and high profile sights. Both boys had to rotate their hand around the circumference of the grip frame of the Cadet to get a decent finger/trigger relationship. Unfortunately that hurts the ability to control the shot well. The big picture is to get the new shooter comfortable with the noise and the guns activity. And speaking of pictures, be sure to bring pen and paper to draw out the sight alignment, etc. I can't believe how difficult it is to get that across without a visual aid!

Just be sure to give them 100% supervision when it's in their hands. You need to be right there with them and you better be sharply focused on safety. The biggest thing to watch out for is muzzle control. I don't know how many times I caught my kids attempting swing the barrel the direction of their attention / conversation, it's just a natural reaction. A close second is trigger finger placement. Kids just can't help but put their finger on the trigger even long before they are ready to shoot.

In the end it's up to the parents to decide when and how a child is introduced to firearms and the responsibility that goes with it. My oldest was three months shy of his eighth birthday. My younger son shot for the first time when he was seven and a half. In both cases the boys quickly tired of shooting and found just as much interest in the various things they found laying around the shooting range. Make it a point to keep it short in the beginning regardless of what/where you shoot. This isn't easy to do in California as we often have to drive quite a ways to shoot. I would also make it a point to shoot alone as a group and outdoors. The noise and distraction of the indoor range isn't a good place to introduce the shooting sports (and likely is also prohibited by most indoor ranges anyway). Both my boys shot for the first time out of state while on vacation in a very rural part or Oregon.

Whew! Long post, hope it's helpful!