Re: Founding Member Stories...

[sdphoto]

While reading the post I cant really understand this comment..

"I wanted to badly to draw my weapon and have it at the low ready, in hind site I should have done, I risked my own life because I did not want my client to see me with a gun and I knew if drew I would have to report it to the Sheriff which might have been the end of my CCW. "

He felt in strong danger for his life and that of his clients, How would that have jeopardized his lic.?

[Python2]

Originally Posted by sdphoto

While reading the post I cant really understand this comment..


"I wanted to badly to draw my weapon and have it at the low ready, in hind site I should have done, I risked my own life because I did not want my client to see me with a gun and I knew if drew I would have to report it to the Sheriff which might have been the end of my CCW. "

He felt in strong danger for his life and that of his clients, How would that have jeopardized his lic.?

BRANDISHING! you lose your CCW. You only draw to pull the trigger to stop an imminent threat to your life. Feeling you are in danger is not ground to draw IMHO.

[IAmASensFan]

Originally Posted by Python2

BRANDISHING! you lose your CCW. You only draw to pull the trigger to stop an imminent threat to your life. Feeling you are in danger is not ground to draw IMHO.

uhhh...if you draw, you don't HAVE to pull the trigger...if drawing and aiming are enough to stop the threat, then that is sufficient.

Pulling the trigger at that point is going to get you in trouble if there are witnesses to the guy ceasing to be a threat and you still shooting him.

If I have 6 or 7 people advancing on me, moving as if to surround, with sticks and such, my "feeling" I am in danger isn't enough to draw and try and circumvent the situtaion?

Thats silly

[sdphoto]

I guess that situation is catch 22, I would have definitely drawed even if it meant losing my Lic. Its like driving and someone has road rage against me and trying to ram me off the road over a cliff, I will do my best to make him go over before me and risk losing my drivers lic and not my life.

[BonoVox]

I read the story a while ago. I seem to remember he heard what he thought was a group of Meth Heads in the bushes.

Don't under estimate the value of running away. Retreat is your friend if you have that choice. IMO the first option always. Can I safely run and get the heck out of Dodge??

What if......you draw and are being stealth running around in the bushes. Did you think that maybe someone else might have called in a complaint about the ruckus in the bush? Now Mr. LEO is also out with a weapon drawn and happens to come across you with your gun drawn.

What if the "Meth Heads" are a bunch of 14 year olds out sneaking some cigs in the bush??

[Python2]

Originally Posted by IAmASensFan

If I have 6 or 7 people advancing on me, moving as if to surround, with sticks and such, my "feeling" I am in danger isn't enough to draw and try and circumvent the situtaion?

Thats silly

In your schenario, IMHO, you are not "feeling in danger", ou are under imminent threat of bodily injury and I will grip my weapon ready to draw and to warn them to stop advancing and if they continue,I will be in fear of my life, and I will draw and drop the guy nearest, no question and the next until I stop the advance. But wait! As I draw my weapon and in the process of aligning my site to the nearest guy and I see a change in the guys movement such as surprise and a slight retreat for that matter, then I will not pull the trigger. I will slowly step back away from them. What I really meant was never draw to scare, you draw to shoot. But I am not saying that once you draw you shoot. You still have a split second to align your site and make the final decision to pull the trigger. It also depends on the seriousnes of the situation whether to draw or not.

Also, I do not think feeling in danger is equivalent to imminent threat to your life. You may feel in danger but there maybe some other way out of it without drawing.

[IAmASensFan]

Originally Posted by Python2

What I really meant was never draw to scare, you draw to shoot. But I am not saying that once you draw you shoot. You still have a split second to align your site and make the final decision to pull the trigger. It also depends on the seriousnes of the situation whether to draw or not.

Also, I do not think feeling in danger is equivalent to imminent threat to your life. You may feel in danger but there maybe some other way out of it without drawing.

Ok, that changes everything.

No, I would never consider drawing to scare. THAT *IS* brandishing.

My quotation marks around "Feeling" were used to emphasize based on what you said.

The reality is, in the exact definition I described, "Feeling" like your life was in danger is a matter of symantecs. EVERY juror would know what you mean by that.

If I am in a 707, and it suddenly goes nose down and begins a decent of 700 miles per hour, I would not be inaccurate to say I have a "Feeling" something is wrong.

Likewise, if said ruffians were surrounding me with metal rods, chains and numchuks, I could say I had a "Feeling" that Imminent Danger was fast approaching.

While retreating, and if the threat continues or escalates, I'm pretty confident that drawing your gun WHILE YOU CONTINUE TO RETREAT, would NOT be a problem. You are not brandishing...You are not using it to coerce, scare or intimidate, you are using it to ensure your safety.

[IAmASensFan]

Originally Posted by BonoVox

I read the story a while ago. I seem to remember he heard what he thought was a group of Meth Heads in the bushes.

Don't under estimate the value of running away. Retreat is your friend if you have that choice. IMO the first option always. Can I safely run and get the heck out of Dodge??

What if......you draw and are being stealth running around in the bushes. Did you think that maybe someone else might have called in a complaint about the ruckus in the bush? Now Mr. LEO is also out with a weapon drawn and happens to come across you with your gun drawn.

What if the "Meth Heads" are a bunch of 14 year olds out sneaking some cigs in the bush??

Yes, you are right...this thread has taken off on a tangent, and the discussions of groups of people with chains and stuff was used as a different anaology than the original story.

[Glock32]

Originally Posted by IAmASensFan

Ok, that changes everything.


While retreating, and if the threat continues or escalates, I'm pretty confident that drawing your gun WHILE YOU CONTINUE TO RETREAT, would NOT be a problem. You are not brandishing...You are not using it to coerce, scare or intimidate, you are using it to ensure your safety.

You will still file a report with OCSD per the terms of your license.

[SierraNevadaCCW]

Technically....if you draw your weapon in self defense because you feel your life is threatened...you are not "brandishing". It's in the penal code...as an exemption...

That said...it might be your word against theirs (plural) because they usually outnumber you when your the victim...and they could ask you be arrested for brandishing.

It's a split second decision and your training, 6th sense and logic should dictate your actions. Fearing that your permit will be yanked can be bad if you are really in danger...however it can be good to keep you out of trouble...

It's a hard call sometimes.

[X-ffdo]

It is about saving lives! Your life!
If you think someone is "about to cancel your ticket", and you fear for your life......you will know what to do!
Worry about it later, when your awareness makes you conceptualize the fact that you are are still intact. Thank God!