1st LEO encounter

[Desert_Rat]

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Well it finally happened.I went to the local CHP office to meet my wife there for Vin verification on a motorcycle.I pulled into the lot.The officer was there already He shakes my hand and goes into bringing Me up speed on the bike.Then I say"In accordance with the instructions set by the county Sheriff,I need to tell you that I have a CCW license and am armed at this time"The officer replies fine with Me,we need to go into the office so leave it in your truck."Then while he waits I unloaded it and lock it up in the service body of My truck. Then we go about business as usual.Kinda weird to handle it in front of a LEO for Me, but as it turns out it was a non-event as well.

[The Black Knight]

Guys, I moved your Harley discussion to Sam's Saloon. Here is the link:

http://www.calccw.com/Forums/sams-sa...iscussion.html

[Gronk Bronson]

Sounds like things went pretty much by the book. I think CHP, BPD, and KCSD are all pretty well versed when dealing with CCW individuals in Kern County since so many permits are issued here.

I would also be a little un-nerved by handling my firearm around LEO for the first time. You keep it safe and professional!

[BonoVox]

I guess they do not allow CCW in the station. So that makes for an interesting situation. At least he did not arrest you for breaking PC 417!

[Desert_Rat]

What else were my options?Just leave and not take care of business?I was truly weirded out by this part.
Edited to add: I did not brandish in a rude or threatening manner.I just backed uo into the open door and took caro of it,then moved to the box.No Problem

[chpray]

Before when I retired from CHP in 2006, we had a notice on our front door. It stated that carrying of firearms on CHP property was not authorized for non law enforcement officers. This a regulation that came into effect in the late 1980s-early 1990s. It was in the California Administrative Code, now called the Code of California Regulations (CCR).

The regulation stated that the head of each state agency was given the authority to determine if the carrying of firearms on state property controlled by the state agency was allowed or not. In turn each department head could delegate this authority down to a state facility manager. It also covered allowing/not allowing state employees to carry when they were at work.

California Exposition and State Fair has such a regulation at Cal Expo in Sacramento. There is an exemption for peace officers. Been up to my last CHP office quite a few times since retirement, but haven't seen the notice. I'm waiting for an e-mail answer on getting the specific reference.

This is probably what the CHP officer was doing.

[Desert_Rat]

chpray
Thanks for the "inside info"

[X-ffdo]

I think, as a matter of order, there should be a consensus on the meaning of the word "brandish", at least for us here. The press has seen to it that it gets blurred.

[G36 Steve]

Originally Posted by X-ffdo

I think, as a matter of order, there should be a consensus on the meaning of the word "brandish", at least for us here. The press has seen to it that it gets blurred.

It's the perception of the victim.
I seriously doubt a CHP officer watching you secure your weapon before entering the station would be perceived as threatening especially when he asked you to do it.

[mjones]

Originally Posted by X-ffdo

I think, as a matter of order, there should be a consensus on the meaning of the word "brandish", at least for us here. The press has seen to it that it gets blurred.

Brandish isn't defined anywhere in the CA Penal Code, but this is the most appropriate definition from the CA PC.

417.  (a) (1) Every person who, except in self-defense, in the
presence of any other person, draws or exhibits any deadly weapon
whatsoever, other than a firearm, in a rude, angry, or threatening
manner, or who in any manner, unlawfully uses a deadly weapon other
than a firearm in any fight or quarrel is guilty of a misdemeanor,
punishable by imprisonment in a county jail for not less than 30
days.
   (2) Every person who, except in self-defense, in the presence of
any other person, draws or exhibits any firearm, whether loaded or
unloaded, in a rude, angry, or threatening manner, or who in any
manner, unlawfully uses a firearm in any fight or quarrel is
punishable as follows:

[NikNak]

Originally Posted by X-ffdo

I think, as a matter of order, there should be a consensus on the meaning of the word "brandish", at least for us here. The press has seen to it that it gets blurred.

When your arm is on fire and you wave it about ...... you are "brandishing a fire arm." Does the same code apply?

[X-ffdo]

Originally Posted by mjones

Brandish isn't defined anywhere in the CA Penal Code, but this is the most appropriate definition from the CA PC.

417.  (a) (1) Every person who, except in self-defense, in the
presence of any other person, draws or exhibits any deadly weapon
whatsoever, other than a firearm, in a rude, angry, or threatening
manner, or who in any manner, unlawfully uses a deadly weapon other
than a firearm in any fight or quarrel is guilty of a misdemeanor,
punishable by imprisonment in a county jail for not less than 30
days.
   (2) Every person who, except in self-defense, in the presence of
any other person, draws or exhibits any firearm, whether loaded or
unloaded, in a rude, angry, or threatening manner, or who in any
manner, unlawfully uses a firearm in any fight or quarrel is
punishable as follows:

Remember recently when Obama had some public meetings and some US citizens showed up armed? Some journalists in our so call free press, used that word, they said that these people were "brandishing". I did not see in the news anyone waving a gun in an angry, threatening way.
I agree with the above definitions as defined. Not with the press interpretation.
It sounds like to them any sight of a fire arm while being carried by a citizen is "brandishing".
Next time, I intend to let them know!

[chpray]

This is just a short hand term used by Calif LEOs. Crime, arrest, booking forms don't give you a lot of room to describe the specific crime. So instead of having to write/type in "...drawing/exhibiting a firearm in a threatening manner against..." at the top of your report, it became "Brandishing a firearm". The DA would have all the fancy/legal stuff in the charge sheets and court proceeding documents. At least thats what I remember from when I started in 1973.

[X-ffdo]

Originally Posted by NikNak

When your arm is on fire and you wave it about ...... you are "brandishing a fire arm." Does the same code apply?

Got it!

[Spicy McHaggis]

Jury instructions for PC 417

http://www.calccw.com/Forums/general...c-417-2-a.html

Brandishing a firearm: (Penal Code section 417(a)(2)

(CALCRIM 983)

To prove that the defendant is guilty of this crime, the People must prove that:

1. The defendant drew or exhibited a firearm in the immediate presence of someone else;
2. The defendant did so in a rude, angry, or threatening manner;
OR
2. The defendant unlawfully used the firearm in a fight or quarrel;

AND
3. The defendant did not act (in self-defense/[or] in defense of someone else).]

Included in the instructions for this crime is CALCRIM 250 (Union of Act and Intent; General Criminal Intent)

Every crime charged in this case requires proof of the union, or joint operation, of act and wrongful intent.

In order to be guilty of the crime of [PC 417(a)(2)], a person must not only commit the prohibited act, but must do so intentionally or on purpose. The act required is explained in the instructions for each crime. However, it is not required that he or she intend to break the law.