Kudos to Kaiser

[DParker]

Being in good health, I rarely went to the doctor until last summer. Since last summer I have suffered three totally unrelated surgeries and many follow up visits.

At my first visit last summer, I went in with intense left arm pain. Didn't even think about my PM9 since it was 'just my left arm'. The specialist had me remove my outer shirt as I sat on the table so he could do extensive reflex tests and probe my upper body. He was assisted by a female nurse. I had my usual black wife beater on with the PM9 holstered IWB on my right side. Neither he nor her even batted an eye. They eventually diagnosed a severe exposed nerve in my lower neck with required major spinal surgery. Fun.

Then in October, gall stones sent me to emergency (also at Kaiser) resulting in surgery to remove the gall bladder. Was armed at every visit. No questions, no problem.

Broke my left elbow in January which led to more emergency room time and another surgery and another night in hospital. Again, no problem.

Have been doing additional tests and x-rays over the last few weeks for other issues (when I turned 50, my body apparently fell apart) and have twice recently had to remove my outer shirt for chest x-rays. Latest one was today. Always different technicians and nobody has ever questioned or cared that I'm armed.

Just thought I'd share that if you are in the Fresno area and a Kaiser member, they seem to be perfectly fine with armed patients. Multiple doctors, specialists, and nurses have never batted an eye at mine.

[Feather]

My experience at Kaiser in Panorama City, California was a little different. In the late 1990's I had a gun in an IWB holster and was required to remove my shirt during an examination. The doctor saw my gun and commented on it. I told him that I had a permit to carry a concealed weapon and I showed him the permit. He never said another word about the gun. About a week later I received a polite letter from their director of security. He said that although I had a CCW and broke no laws, they would prefer that guns not be brought onto their "campus."

Their preference is not my preference; I continue to carry a gun.

[EM2]

I have but one question, do you let them know ahead of time before removing your shirt that you are armed so as not to alarm them?
I have not yet had a need to see a doctor since I got my CCW and would like to know how this goes.

[TaxMan]

Originally Posted by Feather

My experience at Kaiser in Panorama City, California was a little different. In the late 1990's I had a gun in an IWB holster and was required to remove my shirt during an examination. The doctor saw my gun and commented on it. I told him that I had a permit to carry a concealed weapon and I showed him the permit. He never said another word about the gun. About a week later I received a polite letter from their director of security. He said that although I had a CCW and broke no laws, they would prefer that guns not be brought onto their "campus."

Their preference is not my preference; I continue to carry a gun.

However, you have been notified that they don't want you carrying at their place of business. You could be considered a trespasser if they "catch" you again. Just my $.02.

[gr8fatman]

I don't have Kaiser, but have found my Dr.s and specific staff members to be very understanding. I don't carry to my heart Dr, as I spend most of visit without a shirt and get shuffled between different exam/testing rooms.

EM2, I always quietly talk to the Dr / nurse, who will be exposed to my gun prior to removing my shirt. But as mentioned before, if I'm going to be moving through hallways of the office or hospital shirtless, I choose not to carry and expose my gun to other patients or staff that don't need to know.

[Gronk Bronson]

I'm very fortunate that my Dr. is an avid shooter and gun collector. He knows I have a CCW permit and works around it. As soon as he enters the examination room we usually start talking guns for at least 10 to 15 minutes before he realizes he has an office full of people waiting to see him. Then he gets me handled and out of there as quickly as he can. I would say make sure your Dr is pro 2A if you plan to carry in his office for an office visit. As for a visit to the ER I haven't had to cross that bridge yet thank God!

[Keith92555]

Originally Posted by DParker

Being in good health, I rarely went to the doctor until last summer. Since last summer I have suffered three totally unrelated surgeries and many follow up visits.

At my first visit last summer, I went in with intense left arm pain. Didn't even think about my PM9 since it was 'just my left arm'. The specialist had me remove my outer shirt as I sat on the table so he could do extensive reflex tests and probe my upper body. He was assisted by a female nurse. I had my usual black wife beater on with the PM9 holstered IWB on my right side. Neither he nor her even batted an eye. They eventually diagnosed a severe exposed nerve in my lower neck with required major spinal surgery. Fun.

Then in October, gall stones sent me to emergency (also at Kaiser) resulting in surgery to remove the gall bladder. Was armed at every visit. No questions, no problem.

Broke my left elbow in January which led to more emergency room time and another surgery and another night in hospital. Again, no problem.

Have been doing additional tests and x-rays over the last few weeks for other issues (when I turned 50, my body apparently fell apart) and have twice recently had to remove my outer shirt for chest x-rays. Latest one was today. Always different technicians and nobody has ever questioned or cared that I'm armed.

Just thought I'd share that if you are in the Fresno area and a Kaiser member, they seem to be perfectly fine with armed patients. Multiple doctors, specialists, and nurses have never batted an eye at mine.

Originally Posted by Feather

My experience at Kaiser in Panorama City, California was a little different. In the late 1990's I had a gun in an IWB holster and was required to remove my shirt during an examination. The doctor saw my gun and commented on it. I told him that I had a permit to carry a concealed weapon and I showed him the permit. He never said another word about the gun. About a week later I received a polite letter from their director of security. He said that although I had a CCW and broke no laws, they would prefer that guns not be brought onto their "campus."

Their preference is not my preference; I continue to carry a gun.

Nothing surprising here. We're talking Madera Co vs. Los Angeles Co. Would you expect anything different? I was carrying at Kaiser for opthamology dept. Gun got bumped during vital sign check and during the exam by the MD but no one said anything. Prolly thought it was my cell phone.

[spc]

My local General Practitioner is a local CCW holder and reloader as well. We qualify together every year. Yes it is cool.

spc

[Feather]

The letter stated "preference" and I repeated it in the context it was used. Stating a preference does not equate to a requirement. I have a preference to win the lottery, but that does not mean I shall win the lottery. My perference is to carry a gun based on my CCW permit when I visit Kaiser and shall continue to do so until I am clearly notified that it is prohibited.

[DParker]

Originally Posted by EM2

I have but one question, do you let them know ahead of time before removing your shirt that you are armed so as not to alarm them?
I have not yet had a need to see a doctor since I got my CCW and would like to know how this goes.

I have never said a thing. I act normal, and so far, nobody has ever mentioned it.

[Keith92555]

Originally Posted by Feather

The letter stated "preference" and I repeated it in the context it was used. Stating a preference does not equate to a requirement. I have a preference to win the lottery, but that does not mean I shall win the lottery. My perference is to carry a gun based on my CCW permit when I visit Kaiser and shall continue to do so until I am clearly notified that it is prohibited.

+1. You know, when you think about places where mass shootings have taken place, it is USUALLY someplace where the shooter has some sort of grievance. Postal workers mad at management, employees upset over layoffs, customers angry over perceived maltreatment from customer service, etc... It is easy to imagine someone getting torqued at a health care provider who is not treating their illness properly or refusing to treat a particular ailment. This is PROBABLY why we have an armed police force at the VA Hospital where I work. Wouldn't you think they would welcome anyone who is armed and NOT pissed off at their health care workers? When someone comes into Kaiser to exact their revenge at "the System," they will definitely be happy that Feather is there and armed (see my signature line). Rock on Feather!

[derringer]

Hey, guys! Where's the uproar?! Whatever happened to "concealed means concealed"? I guess you all meant "concealed sometimes means concealed".

You know, all it would take would be for one doctor or nurse to make a call to the Sheriff and your CCW could be revoked for "brandishing", right? I don't think there are any exceptions on my CCW for exposing my gun in a public or private establishment. Just tread lightly.

I guess this is how we in CCW-friendly Sutter County ended up with "no guns" signs on the doors of one of our medical buildings. Every time I see them it pisses me off. Might also be the reason some emergency rooms have walk-through metal detectors and security guards. If you know you might have to expose your weapon, I recommend "playing it safe" by leaving the gun in the car.

[Keith92555]

Originally Posted by derringer

Hey, guys! Where's the uproar?! Whatever happened to "concealed means concealed"? I guess you all meant "concealed sometimes means concealed".

You know, all it would take would be for one doctor or nurse to make a call to the Sheriff and your CCW could be revoked for "brandishing", right? I don't think there are any exceptions on my CCW for exposing my gun in a public or private establishment. Just tread lightly.

I guess this is how we in CCW-friendly Sutter County ended up with "no guns" signs on the doors of one of our medical buildings. Every time I see them it pisses me off. Might also be the reason some emergency rooms have walk-through metal detectors and security guards. If you know you might have to expose your weapon, I recommend "playing it safe" by leaving the gun in the car.

I believe the OP was referring to ER visits, which in a lot of instances may not lend itself readily to removing the weapon and storing it in the car (arrival by ambulance being one instance). Also, many times we aren't expecting to have to remove a garment and expose our weapon. It is prudent to remove the weapon before any examination if you suspect that you may have to remove any garments.

At my eye appointment today I was reasonably sure that there would be no exposure of the weapon (thank goodness for cell phones). If I was going for a check-up, I would have had to leave it in the truck. If I were ever put in the position of having to remove a cover garment unexpectedly during an exam, I would have to inform the examiner and ask if they were comfortable with it and if not excuse myself to put it into the truck.

[DParker]

Originally Posted by derringer

Hey, guys! Where's the uproar?! Whatever happened to "concealed means concealed"? I guess you all meant "concealed sometimes means concealed".

You know, all it would take would be for one doctor or nurse to make a call to the Sheriff and your CCW could be revoked for "brandishing", right? I don't think there are any exceptions on my CCW for exposing my gun in a public or private establishment. Just tread lightly.

"Brandishing" doesn't come into play here. Look it up. It could no more be "brandishing", then disrobing for a medical examination would be "indecent exposure".

[derringer]

Originally Posted by DParker

"Brandishing" doesn't come into play here. Look it up. It could no more be "brandishing", then disrobing for a medical examination would be "indecent exposure".

You're correct. Thankyou. I should have said "illegal open carry". Is that any better?