NRA and the 11/18 BOS Meeting

[Harry Carry]

Just as a little background...

As far back as July, barely a month after the Sheriff's swearing in, several members of this forum began reaching out to the BOS. In October and November, briefing books were prepared to help the BOS see all facets of the issue. The mystical AG memo, so long quoted by snippet, was obtained by one of our members and dissected by our lawyers to give the BOS the proper context in which it was originally produced. Meetings were then held with four of the five supervisors. Their staffs began calling us for further information.

How do I know this?

I prepared the briefing books. I attended two of the meetings with Supervisors. Other members conducted the remaining two meetings.

Up until the night before the BOS meeting their staff were calling us. I know. My phone was one of those ringing.

Those 200+ people in attendance? Search the net to see where the first mentions of the meeting and its importance were. Here. Our mighty Whip, Dan M., also posted info on CalGuns. Why did we push for so many to be there? Because in the very first meeting with one of the supervisors they said, 'You need numbers.' So we gave them numbers.

Several members of the BOS asked if the NRA would be there. This was in late October. As of that date, they had apparently not been engaged in this issue. We told the supervisors that we hoped they would be. And we are glad they were there.

But they did not organize this. They did not understand the totality of all the issues regarding Sheriff Hutchen's actions. We did and still do.

That is why it is important, both for the issue and for the NRA, to realize that we are the ground game here. We are in the trenches because it is our fight. We can rapidly respond to the Sheriff's actions if need be, just as we have all along.

If people believe the NRA is the point on this issue, they will not be in contact with the dedicated folks who, for months and months, have gathered information, crafted legal arguments, and worked to enlist our elected representatives' involvement. We appreciate the NRA's support, but hopefully they will recognize this as the grass roots effort it is, and not just another tool to increase their membership.

[GunSlut]

Well said! I also know the above is fact, I have been one of the people involved since she was appointed Sheriff.

[Superchief]

For the record, I'd like to hear from the NRA and have them describe what their role is, and has been, in support of this initiative. And, if they in deed would like to support this important action, than come forward, and in a public way announce what type of support they can offer. I think they owe this to all the NRA members in the OC and on this site.

[spc]

This sounds like an incredible idea. We would now know what to expect and how to go about using this information to our best advantage. ? . ?

spc

[Superchief]

I've reached out to Ed Worley, the NRA representative for California politics. Ed is in Sacramento and apparently was present at the recent BOS meeting. I've emailed and phoned him but recieved no response.

[Dan M.]

Originally Posted by Superchief

I've reached out to Ed Worley, the NRA representative for California politics. Ed is in Sacramento and apparently was present at the recent BOS meeting. I've emailed and phoned him but recieved no response.

He was the very first guy to speak at the meeting.

[sealbeach]

I expected trouble from the Brady bunch, but I NEVER expected our biggest headaches would be from the NRA.

[Superchief]

In response to messages I left for Ed Worley I received a call yesterday from Ed Worley and Paul Payne. Ed is the California representative for the NRA out of Sacramento, and Paul Payne works for Wayne LaPierre. This should tell you something about how serious the NRA is about this issue. As stated earlier by Dan M; founding member, Ed was indeed the first speaker at the BOS meeting. I asked them both very candidly what the NRAs position is on this matter and what the NRA is prepared to do to support our cause and their members. This is my account of their response;

First, the NRA has assigned Chuck Michel as legal counsel to this situation. Chuck is reviewing the revoked CCWs and offering advise. Ed and Chuck are reviewing current CCW holders and those revoked to try and determine if the new policy is being applied consistently. If you recall from the BOS meeting, this may be a problem for the sheriff. Chuck is also offering his legal opinion to the BOS and anybody who will listen, on the 1977 California state attorney general good cause opinion letter. This is critical because the sheriff's entire policy turns on this document and if she can be pushed off the letter, her policy may change.

Additionally, ED and Paul are in the OC next week to follow up on things and do what they can. Paul is keeping the NRA headquarters apprised of the situation. They made it clear that they’re with us until a resolution is found. I told them I appreciated their support.

As for the accusation of taking credit for the BOS meeting, they were both very gracious and said the credit goes to those involved from the beginning and that as long as things turn out positively, what else matters? Ed said he met privately with members of the BOS or their staff to show his support and be a visible representative of the NRA. Ed also said he had been in contact with the BOS and their staff prior to the meeting and was very pleased that the meeting had a nice turn out of well spoken, concerned and qualified citizens.

I invite your comments and feedback.

Don't shoot the messenger.

[swdr]

Sounds very reasonable. Thanks for the report.

I'm certain that the NRA takes this issue seriously. They're reputation was tarnished at the BOS meeting by their representatives, and they found out about the damage those had done only after the dust settled. Hopefully, somebody from the NRA side with a bit of clout has noticed this (cough Wayne cough). Normally, whenever a gun issue generates so much heat, the NRA is a natural beneficiary, which was why they were here (not to mention their interest in 2A support even if they haven't thought of CCW as much of a California issue in the past.)

It's good that Michel is trying to come up to speed on the specific issues here in OC. I can understand why he's offering his advice to "anybody who will listen". The BOS has already been briefed in detail by us.

Yes, the '77 AG letter has significance. But there is no sense jousting with windmills.

It's good that Ed and Just H are in town next week. So far, they seems to be looking in all the wrong places for advice. Hopefully, that will change. If not, we'll have to continue to be polite, but try to keep them from mucking things up further.

I'm glad their with us. If they actually begin supporting us, that would be good. So far, their support has been negative. I'd like to see that turned around. Saying, in private that credit for the BOS meeting goes to those involved is a start. But as matters sit, their support is still a negative. It's just become more polite.

Ed (and Chuck) being "in contact" with BOS and their staff prior to the meeting was part of their negative support. The impact of the BOS meeting was lessened because of that contact. But, I'm sure that they didn't understand how big a showing we would be able to generate, so they can be forgiven for that. We'll just try not to have that happen again. I'm hopeful that the Just H and Michel electioneering won't continue. We'll have to wait and see.

(BTW, I'm sure Just H has a name, but for now, he's earned this one.)

[rhbanjo]

OK maybe someone can enlighten me- I have received and replied to the "Intent to revoke letter" and attended the BOS 11/18 meeting. I am (I think) the example the Sheriff had in her PPT presentation of someone that doesn't deserve a CCW (according to her- Avid competitive shooter).
Are you saying that the NRA legal beagles have access to my information? I've resigned myself to the fact that Sheriff Hutchens is going to do what she wants, regardless of what we or the BOS thinks. I was awarded this permit based on information I provided to the Sheriff at that time and don't quite understand why an appointed Sheriff feels it's her duty to besmirch my character in this way.
Back to my point- what does the NRA intend to do as far as this subject? Are they planning any lawsuits or just "Chuck is reviewing the revoked CCWs and offering advise"? Does he actually think Jerry Brown is going to work with law abiding gun owners? We've lost Arnold as a conservative on our side. What can we do to turn this situation around? Any comments?

[Dan M.]

First things first - do you qualify for the "banjo" in your name? Please demonstrate a few basic forward and reverse rolls. What brand of finger picks do you use? Do you even have a banjo, and if so, what brand/model?

Anyway, some of the questions you ask about the NRA are questions we hope to get answered at the meeting Just H announced for next Thursday. Whether Chuck has access or not can probably be answered by one of the Inside Loopers here. As these things shake out we can share more, but as I understand it, developments are continuing and we just need to be patient.

Originally Posted by rhbanjo

OK maybe someone can enlighten me- I have received and replied to the "Intent to revoke letter" and attended the BOS 11/18 meeting. I am (I think) the example the Sheriff had in her PPT presentation of someone that doesn't deserve a CCW (according to her- Avid competitive shooter).
Are you saying that the NRA legal beagles have access to my information? I've resigned myself to the fact that Sheriff Hutchens is going to do what she wants, regardless of what we or the BOS thinks. I was awarded this permit based on information I provided to the Sheriff at that time and don't quite understand why an appointed Sheriff feels it's her duty to besmirch my character in this way.
Back to my point- what does the NRA intend to do as far as this subject? Are they planning any lawsuits or just "Chuck is reviewing the revoked CCWs and offering advise"? Does he actually think Jerry Brown is going to work with law abiding gun owners? We've lost Arnold as a conservative on our side. What can we do to turn this situation around? Any comments?

[Spicy McHaggis]

CCW records in CA are public information. Anyone that has the cash and some time can file a PRAR to get that information. Certain information in those records are not available to the public.

I also highly doubt the NRA is reviewing CCW records at this moment because she HASN'T REVOKED any yet. You can't review revoked CCW records to see if they are being applied fairly if she hasn't revoked the 400+ she plans on revoking.

[rhbanjo]

[quote=Dan M.;111300]First things first - do you qualify for the "banjo" in your name? Please demonstrate a few basic forward and reverse rolls. What brand of finger picks do you use? Do you even have a banjo, and if so, what brand/model?

Funny- didn't think about anyone asking about the name. Yes, I ran with the best and still try to keep up- pure traditional bluegrass- no Pat Cloud fancy stuff for me! Here are the rolls- hope you can hear them. I use 1941's and National re-issue. My original National's wore out. Yes- I played a gold Fender Concertone for years and now play a custom RB-4 by Bill Sullivan (RIP). How's about you?

Oh yeah- I still have it in my craw that the temporary Sheriff is planning to do as she pleases. I got the feeling at the BOS 11/18 meeting that she politely listened to us and smiled and will do as she will. I was directly behind her about 3 or 4 rows and was watching her reactions to different speakers. Not much reaction by the way... only to the old man that couldn't remember her name.

[CCWInstructor]

Ordinary California Citizens Concerned With Safety (OCCCWS) was founded following the appointment of Sandra Hutchens as Sheriff of Orange County. With the help of members from CalCCW.com, OCCCWS began an aggressive campaign to fight the Sheriff's restrictive new CCW policy, bringing the issue to the Orange County Board of Supervisors through letters, e-mails, phone calls, and direct contact. The result of these efforts was the domination of the November 18th Board of Supervisors meeting by the CCW issue.

OCCCWS representatives met with the Supervisors in the months leading up to the meeting, briefing them on the issue and legal matters concerning CCW in California. The Supervisors' request was that they needed 'numbers' at the November 18th meeting to gauge the importance of CCW to Orange County residents. As a result, OCCCWS and CalCCW began a coordinated effort to bring supporters of the Second Amendment together for this crucial show of commitment. Members of CalGuns.com, the California Rifle and Pistol Association, and the National Rifle Association all stepped up to the plate, along with unaffiliated supporters, and sent a message to the Board of Supervisors, and to Sheriff Hutchens, that CCW is an issue that is here to stay.

OCCCWS was proud to be at the forefront of this fight, and will continue to press the issue with Sheriff Hutchens, and with those elected officials who appointed her to her position. The assistance of other organizations, particularly the NRA, will be vitally important and much appreciated as OCCCWS expands its efforts against anti Second Amendment policies and the officials who support them.

[Diamond Jim]

Originally Posted by CCWInstructor

Ordinary California Citizens Concerned With Safety (OCCCWS) was founded following the appointment of Sandra Hutchens as Sheriff of Orange County. With the help of members from CalCCW.com, OCCCWS began an aggressive campaign to fight the Sheriff's restrictive new CCW policy, bringing the issue to the Orange County Board of Supervisors through letters, e-mails, phone calls, and direct contact. The result of these efforts was the domination of the November 18th Board of Supervisors meeting by the CCW issue.

OCCCWS representatives met with the Supervisors in the months leading up to the meeting, briefing them on the issue and legal matters concerning CCW in California. The Supervisors' request was that they needed 'numbers' at the November 18th meeting to gauge the importance of CCW to Orange County residents. As a result, OCCCWS and CalCCW began a coordinated effort to bring supporters of the Second Amendment together for this crucial show of commitment. Members of CalGuns.com, the California Rifle and Pistol Association, and the National Rifle Association all stepped up to the plate, along with unaffiliated supporters, and sent a message to the Board of Supervisors, and to Sheriff Hutchens, that CCW is an issue that is here to stay.

OCCCWS was proud to be at the forefront of this fight, and will continue to press the issue with Sheriff Hutchens, and with those elected officials who appointed her to her position. The assistance of other organizations, particularly the NRA, will be vitally important and much appreciated as OCCCWS expands its efforts against anti Second Amendment policies and the officials who support them.

Well said.